He just lies still and I do it all!

I'm so glad I found this site.  I have been married 10+ years, and my husband has gained about 100 pounds since we met.  We were both college athletes, but he now has a huge belly and big fat "pouch" where there shouldn't be one, and he's so out of shape that we really can't have sex at all anymore unless he just lies still and I do it all.  Looking at him getting out of the shower today, I realized that I have just become totally repulsed.  Then tonight he complained that he doesn't get any sex anymore.  It's true:  sex with him is terrible, and I no longer desire sex with him.

Like other posters here, I am very disappointed that our once active lifestyle has become just a series of meals to him.  Even on vacation, his primary concern is always when are where are we next going to eat, and he likes to order what amounts to two meals for himself.  I see other happy couples who do things like exercise together, and it really makes me sad.  Honestly, he doesn't even have energy to play in the yard with our kids.  I play with them myself and I end up nagging him to go play with them since he's much more skilled at games like catch, but he acts like it's some massive chore and he only lasts out there a couple of minutes.  Hey!  That sounds a bit like our former sex life (we have no current sex life.)

If I didn't have school-aged children, I'd be gone.  I don't see him really making an effort to be healthier, and it's all very upsetting.  I'm trying to make it until the children are out of the house, telling myself that I can be free then, but I'm not sure I will make it.  I do love him, but his obsession with food has taken its toll.

Posted by midwestmonica on the famous My Fat Spouse Forum

Quite a Journey

Yes, this is quite a journey - not only reclaiminng my once fit and attractive body but analyzing my estranged husband's treatment of me as a result of putting on an extraordinary amount of weight - 60 lbs. So far I have lost 15 of it and am very motivated to keep going. Not only for health reasons, and obvious self-esteem benefits but because it is simply something I need to do

I guess I would be more understanding of my husband's position if he had approached the whole issue in a more compassionate and understanding way. His approach has only been very obnoxious and mean-spirited. The nasty looks and very gruff treatment of me when he has brought this up has been very unpleasant.

And while I am certainly not obtuse and realize that you cannot gain a lot of weight and walk around saying "well I am married and take it or leave it" or "well if you loved me you would accept me for how I am". I am fully aware that these are mere copouts said by the overweight person as a demand that their spouse should just be okay with a huge weight gain.

I know I would not be too happy if the shoe were on the other foot and my husband had gotten fat. And again, the problem us heavy-weights must understand is that it is a horse of a different color if the weight gain is beyond one's control and/or from medical reason. Not from personal lack of self-control or will power.

I know in my heart that I will lose every single solitary pound of my weight gain but not for anyone else, but for me.

I only wish my husband had been more loving throughout the process instead of treating me like I have Leprosy.

I don't think I will ever fully manage to rid myself of the memory of his looking at another SLIM woman and when I told him how I felt he said "well, if you weren't heavy I wouldn't have to look" In his mind he was justified !

Good luck to everyone out there ! 

Posted by Just1229 on the My Fat Spouse forum.

Mojo Makes it Happen

 About a little more than two years ago I was still holding onto hope that my situation would improve. My wife and I had been separated several times, but somehow always managed to get back together-usually after making promises of trying harder to give up the countless carbs and tons of sugar and ice cream. Then suddenly, and out of the blue she just gave up-threw her arms up and quit! No, not just quit-she told me under no uncertain terms that she was tired of trying to lose weight, that it was too hard, that she liked carbs, sugar, ice cream, cheese, and fatty foods and the way they all made her feel, that they made her feel good and she needed that, and she wasn’t going to try to stop eating anymore; and if I didn’t like it, that was just too bad-that I could get a divorce because she was never gonna change and she just couldn’t understand why I couldn’t just love her unconditionally the was she was. So that’s when I threw in the towel and filed for divorce. She later told me that she didn’t think I would seriously do it, until the day she was served the papers.

   Fast forward-about six months after the divorce while visiting a friend I bumped into a gorgeous gal. It was like a bolt out of the blue-love at first site! I had never felt anything quite like it before except for maybe my first true love when I was sixteen(I almost married her when she turned 18, but her parents had other plans.) I had been casually dating since the divorce, but I honestly thought it would take several years to find someone I would be able to marry. Anyhow, the rest is as they say, history. We were married  several months ago and both are quite happy. We are still in the honeymoon phase, but I think we are both fairly well grounded in the marriage. Of course, we each have our own peculiarities, but we are so much alike in so many ways-it just plain works. What is really wonderful is that I now have a spouse who “gets it.” She understands me and she knows why I divorced my ex(My ex made certain of that, as she had to tell my bride rather bluntly, “He divorced me for no other reason than I just got fat!”. Boy, was my ex surprised when my bride told her she already knew that and had no problem with it, because she knew what it took to make a man happy and she was willing to do what it takes-namely, to take care of herself.)

   I wish I could tell you that it was all a bed of roses, but that would be a lie. divorce is never really easy, especially when kids are involved, but I can honestly say that for the first time in a very long time I am truly happy. I have a few more years before my youngest child will be out of the house, so there re bound to be concerns. About the only regret I have presently is that I didn’t do the divorce sooner. I really don’t think I did my children any favors by delaying the inevitable as long as I did. They later admitted to me that they knew all along that their mother and I had been having problems for a long time and that we were basically staying together just for them. The hardest part is not being physically close(in distance) to them as I was before my remarriage. So maybe, it would have been better to have waited to remarry for the sake of my children? I don’t know. Sometimes though, before you can properly take care of others, you need to first take care of yourself.

Presently, I suppose I’m feeling a little like Jean Valjean from Les Misérables who’s prison sentence was nearly the same length as my term in fat hell-almost 20 years. Not that my entire marriage was a living hell, there were many happy memories too-my children, for instance. But, I sometimes wonder how it might have been more joy filled had I not had to deal with the addictions with which my wife suffered and struggled so greatly. It certainly would be a different tale to tell-It probably would not have ended in divorce. Though, this is not the end, only a new beginning. Well, at least for me it is.

Now, for those who struggle with these things, if you be the one who suffers, the spouse of an obese partner, you have my empathy-and if you be the obese spouse-my sympathy.  I think I can speak for a few others hear as well, you have theirs too. I would not like to see any divorce, with but few exceptions. Marriage can be hard enough on its own, however, gluttony and obesity are matters that weigh on the relations between a man and a woman in ways which no other can. If sex is to be the barometer of a healthy marriage as some have advocated, then I can think of little else within the control of most sane adults that could be more damaging and damning than willfully allowing oneself to become obese to the degree in which natural sexual relations become greatly frustrated, or nearly impossible altogether.

This is a great problem that is plaguing much of the world, affecting millions. The solutions appear to be rather plain to most who are educated in these matters, however, those choices that must be made on a daily, even a constant bases, apparently are not so easy for many. I would add that I think choices themselves are not so difficult, rather it’s the “doing” part that seems to cause many grief. So, the way may not be easy-only it will be worth it. Unfortunately, it is often a hard thing to accept the fact that with it comes to obesity within a marriage, or any relationship for that matter, the ultimate responsibility is on each individual. It took me many years to finally get that-that I could not make my wife eat better, or exercise, or even loose one single ounce of fat-that ultimately, in the end it was her choice. The only power I had, other than offering my support, was deciding what I was going to do about the situation.

Now you know the rest of the story(or at least the juicy part), but it’s not over yet by any means. Life will go on just as surely as the sun will rise tomorrow, but where we are when it does largely depends on the choices we make today.

Posted by  Mojo on Matilda Tuesday's

Are You An Enabler?

You would have to be living in an isolated cabin in Montana not to have heard of the term "enabler". Basically an enabler is a person that allows another person, in a relationship, to continue with destructive behaviors by covering for them, and helping them out of bad situations caused by their poor judgment. While we typically think of the terms "co-dependency" and "enabler" as terms in dealing with chemical dependencies, it can apply equally to the "fat spouse" situation
Often the non-overweight spouse in this situation engages in "non-helping" assistance that allows the overweight wife or husband to continue to gain weight?


Of course, women are the most prone to engage in this sort of behavior, but men doing this sort of thing are not rare either. The codependency cycle works like this. Person one fears losing the love of the person two that has the bad habit. The fact that person two can not function without person one, makes person one feel needed and whole in a perverse sort of way.

In other words in many cases a husband or wife can in many ways be helping a spouse get bigger and bigger by not allowing that spouse to experience the results of their "fat" ways. Here are a few examples of this kind of behavior.

Do you ever perform tasks, that your spouse has trouble doing because of their weight?

Do you buy into the excuses that your spouse makes concerning diet, (for example discussions of metabolism, genetics, medication) when you know very well that they engage in a lot of unhealthy eating.

Do you cooperate with your spouse's excuse making for not exercising, (e.g. bad knees, too little time, etc.)?

Do you ever buy unhealthy junk food for your spouse at their request?

Do you ever dine at restaurants that serve unhealthy food at your spouse's request?

Perhaps you can see yourself in these questions. Maybe you can now understand how you could be "enabling" your spouse to be obese. Keep in mind that doing these sort of behaviors is silently approving of your wife or husbands overweight habits. This list could go on and on. I encourage you to add any other "fat spouse" enabling activities to the forum.

This article is from the original myfatspouse.com

Why is it that many people treat marriage like an insurance policy?

 Why is it that many people treat marriage like an insurance policy?  Once the ring is slipped on their fingers, some assume they are then free to relax the high standards formerly held which definitely helped to attract and win their new mate-else why would anyone ever bother with the effort to begin with if physical appearance, fitness, and health were not supposed to be important things inside the marriage?
   I have noticed many formerly healthy and attractive spouses, who almost before all the "I Do’s" are said, start pigging out regularly with seemingly reckless abandon, and as a result gain enormous amounts of excess weight with little or no concern for the feelings of the other.  Sometimes a gluttonous spouse will even go so far as to try and sabotage their fit spouse's dieting and health efforts in an apparent attempt to make their fit spouse fat as well, most likely so that their healthy other-half won't be able to take the higher moral ground if they should try voicing any legitimate complaint about their weight gain-I guess misery loves company.  I think it is deplorable the way many will project an image of being health conscious, physically active, exercising, and generally keeping themselves attractive and so forth during the courtship phase, but then, once the marriage is sealed, almost before the ink is even dry, they begin to "let go" and pig out.  Then, when any concern is expressed by their partner who they have sworn an oath to “to love and honor...”, it is met with nothing short of total contempt or accusation, overused lines of total BS like "But you're supposed to love me unconditionally, you a**hole!"  What a crock.
   Where in any legitimate marriage agreement or contract, traditional or contemporary, is it stated that a spouse expected to give “Unconditional Love” irrespective of abuse, neglect, abandonment, or adultery, which all are inclusive to gluttony? If such an illogical concept as “unconditional love” actually exists, then where is their’s?  Will someone please explain how such logic as expecting someone else to love you “unconditionally”, could be anything but irrational?  By demanding “unconditional love”, these selfish hypocrites are themselves affecting a condition by demanding a condition: Unconditional Love!    
   Why is it that popular culture considers a gluttonous self-abasing spouse who becomes a pig after marriage to be a victim or the only victim? Why is free license given for one spouse to become obese at the expense the other’s happiness? Yet, consequently when the healthy spouse naturally looses attraction felt for their formerly fit spouse, the fit spouse is considered to be shallow and selfish.  
   Anything you might read about the evils of domestic violence, alcoholism, addiction, abuse and so forth within marriage is NO DIFFERENT from gluttony.  In fact, gluttony is worse than those evils because it destroys the natural basis that is the catalyst to nearly every romantic relationship which eventually results in marriage, Natural Attraction. Surely, there is a Higher Love than this, but the honest in heart will acknowledge that most all relations, at least those between and man and woman, begin with natural attraction.  Unfortunately, many relationships never advance to this state of Higher Love that transcends advancing age and the normal loss of attraction because the natural process which would normally lead there is stunted, and eventually killed by selfish, greedy, unabashed gluttony! How sad.

Μολὼν λάβε!

 

Posted by Mojo on the My Fat Spouse Forum

It's not for the faint of heart

I don't think that a fat partner considers weight gain to be a personal failure.  

It's due to children, stress, no time for working out, no time to cook healthy meals because of the kids soccer practice, a bad marriage, a horrible boss, an awful job, emotional issues, age related, I was molested (and BTW pretty much everyone was at some point!), I don't feel loved, I don't know HOW to lose weight, diets don't work, I have a thyroid problem, my medication makes me gain weight, or any other excuse you can attach to it.  

But it is rarely because I eat too much, I eat too many (donuts, cheeseburgers, pizza, etc), I don't exercise, or anything else that might resemble personal responsibility.

I don't think I agree with a spouse having the right to walk out without saying a word though...I think it is owed to the spouse to inform them of the reasons for ending the marriage, and if the fat spouse wants to make changes, great!  But those changes would have to be immediately implement with an agreed upon deadline for at least SOME changes.  If not, see ya!  Life's too short!  That's just me though. If the fat spouse doesn't give a $hit or is too lazy to do what it takes then you're banging your head against a brick wall.  I think a spouse owes it to the other to be honest and let them know how they feel, but if after that they refuse to do anything about the situation - whatever it is, not just weight - well, then let the chips fall where they may.  

As for marriage, I find it interesting that when two people decide to marry it's all about emotions & feelings.  That's fantasy land.  Feelings fade - guaranteed.  What must be left is a shared vision for life, mutual respect and some attraction.  Yet, when a couple decides to divorce and one says "I don't love you anymore" people don't want to hear that!  Marriage is no longer about "emotions & feelings" it's now its about responsibility, commitment, and promising to spend your life with someone FOREVER - REGARDLESS of how you feel!!! Yuck.  And on top of it all the government gets to dictate all the details of a couple's divorce where it pertains to money & children - basically the two most important aspects of marriage. I honestly think marriage sucks and am reluctant to ever enter into another.  IMHO. Probably only invented for the purpose of raising children.  But really, who can last an ENTIRE lifetime with the same person, especially when issues like these arise.  You can't control another person, and if they refuse to change, even knowing how adversely something they are doing is affecting the other, then you're SOL and stuck with them simply because of a contract?  No.  Thanks.

People need to think long and hard before entering into such a union.  It's not for the faint of heart.


posted by LiveLifeWell
 on Matilda Tuesday's My Fat Spouse Forum

Inside the Head of a Fat Wife

This fat acceptance blogger is contemplating divorce, because there are "issues" in her marriage. Somewhere around the halfway marker of her entry she says what you already suspect: the "issue" is that her husband can't accept her weight (and "issues with cyber-fidelity" I take to mean that he seeks refuge in porn), and since she joined the FA she has stopped dieting and her husband is worried that she'll keep getting even fatter.

http://randomquorum.wordpress.com/2009/06/02/how-do-you-know-when-its-time-to-divorce/

It's very obvious that the way she sees it, the problem is all with her husband's attitude and losing the weight is not an option. She'd rather divorce her man than ever attempt a diet again. She seems convinced that dieting is dangerous and detrimental to her health, but for my part I'd bet all I have lock, stock and barrel that no amount of evidence in the form of new studies proving that even repeated yo-yo dieting is not a health-hazard would convince her that losing weight might be a good idea after all. The discomfort of going on a diet is a definite no-no and food comes first.

I don't know what to make of it and I'm sort of speechless really, how can it be that food and eating is worth more than saving a good marriage - and can you really get more self-centered and "shallow" than that? Satisfying your immediate physical needs (cravings for food, distaste for exercise) comes before anything and everything else, and you need to get rid of anyone who attempts to come between you and your dinner so to speak.

Why is the most simple and obvious solution so completely out of the question?



A quote (the author replying to a comment), it's about how her husband is dealing with the issue:

He does seem to want to get over it, but he’s back and forth a lot. I’m not sure he’s getting over it so much as learning to keep his mouth shut more often, although he does say that he really is getting better and that it genuinely doesn’t bother him most of the time. So, yeah, I’m not really sure. It seems now to be a lot of “I can deal with how you are now although you’re still kinda fat but I’m terrified that you will get even fatter in the future and if you’re not dieting now then you certainly will”. He can be really good for a month or more and then all of a sudden he will just go into a mood for a day or two (or more) until he tells me that he’s worried and then he’s fine again (and sleeps like a baby – unlike me who becomes distant and depressed and stops sleeping! how unfair).

And my mum is very fat, so I think he’s afraid I’ll end up like her, and if I do then who knows what will happen. IMO it wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world – I love my mum and think she’s awesome and I don’t really notice her fat, but as he’s told me once, he’d rather be dead than me gain 30kgs, so yeah. Who knows.

I don't think there is such a thing as an effortlessly lean and athletic middle-aged individual. It takes hard work and dedication, period. I've been following the debate on Randomquorum, and they now unisonely agree that the husband is abusive, even though the author said he seems to try hard not to bring the subject up, and, if I got it right, only wants her to promise she'll try not to become severely obese like her mother. Somewhat depressingly, a woman who claims to be a professional counselor shares this general opinion.

I don't get this "abuse" -thing. Sure, I'm aware that there are plenty of abusive men out there and they will use a woman's insecurities about her looks and body to control her and destroy her confidence. However, that doesn't mean that every husband who has a wish regarding his wife's appearance is automatically abusive and controlling. I'd say many wives have an opinion on the husband's dress-sense and haircut, and maybe would object if he decided to grow a beard and a moustache, or shave his head or maybe grow a pony-tail and get himself some tattoos. It's hardly abusive to have an opinion regarding those, nor is the husband a victim of abuse if he respects his wife's wishes regarding his looks and style.

For instance, my husband likes me with a certain hairstyle, so even though I might like to try something different I haven't done it because he wouldn't like it - it's no big deal and there's no pressure either way. I just know what he likes and am fine with that. I'd also like to take my fat-percentage down a couple of notches as a challenge and in order to see what the result would be (and I'd like to know if I could ever compete in fitness/figure in my age-group), but my husband tends to complain if I get any leaner and wouldn't be happy having me take on that degree of obsession with workouts & diet, so I probably won't do it. Nothing abusive there either, it's just the kind of compromising you do in a relationship.

So, what I fail to see is, why would a perfectly decent man be labelled an abusive jerk just because he happens to have a preference regarding his wife's looks (which inevitably includes body size)? Just having such a wish and preference (within reason, not anorexic/severely obese or anything else obviously unhealthy) can hardly be wrong. It only becomes abusive if he tries to forcibly impose his wishes, like with verbally and/or physically threatening behavior, destructive manipulation etc.

Balance and Relationships

I have no doubt that having a healthier looking/fitter body improves the quality/quantity of a married couple's sex life; however, let's also consider this other dynamic: 60% percent of married men cheat and 40% of married women cheat - and those are only numbers that reflect people who are willing to admit to adultery.

Therefore, I will always believe - especially as a recovering fatty - becoming physically healthier is a process that must be motivated by something greater than merely looking better for one's spouse....because even a hot body, and a hot sex life, doesn't keep most modern marriages together.

That being said the problem with some is that they go the other way and assume that only 'a nice personality' will keep a modern marriage together.

Relationshps are made up from lots of differant factors and people have many differant needs. Relationships are very hard work, and all things need to be there for it to be healthy and to work out.

People cheat for a huge variety of reasons, not just because of looks issues. Being fed up of a spouses bad attitude can make people resent their spouse and start distancing from them, and finding themselves drawn closer to others for example. Theres a whole host of reasons.

Also the part where you mention 'needs to be for something greater then to look good for their partner', was partly covered in another post called 'putting to rest guilty feelings of shallowness'.

When people don't look after themselves it changes way more then just the physical appearance. Changes run much deeper. A lack of sex life for example can run over into other areas of life, make things harder, stress easier to build, resentment to grow etc.

Phrases like ' what are you so stroppy about? Not getting any at home?' or 'you can tell you havn't had sex for a long time with an attitude like that', aren't new.

Also yes it just as important to be about the person whos getting into shape's health. Thats extremely important. But i guess it isn't mentioned so often (thoug it is on this site) because people think 'well if they lose weight they will get healthier anyway', so maybe they feel no need to mention it. People have their own reasons.

If however a partner is encouraging a partner to do things that are very unhealthy, like starve themselves etc, then yes that would definatly be a wrong thing to do.

Getting in shape should only be done the healthy way.


Wanting your partner to improve health and look after themselves as well as look after their shape for private lives, is a human need and part of a relationship(and they themselves should be doing the same, by the way is you partner? Both need to look after themselves, for themselves and for each other and their realtionship, not only one of them.).
Relationships are not easy.

I know it's more PC to talk about the negatives health aspects of obesity, but rarely, when Anti-Fat issues are discussed, especially by men, is general health the forerunner of the topic. It's almost always geared towards aesthetics and how "disgusting looking" an obese individual is. Now, I will never discredit how unnatural the look of obesity is when manifested in the human species. I've always felt it was unnatural and unattractive.

The differance between men and women is that we need to get erect to have sex. You can't have sex without one of those present. And without any visual stimulation at all, there will be little to no luck in getting ready for sex for most men. Then partners can blame lack of erections on the male partner, saying they have erectile disfunctions when really they are in full working order, only what is naturally needed in order to gain that is missing. And a fact of life is a lack of sex can annoy people and stress people greatly. Just like poeple come on the My Fat Spouse forum and rant and rave, but then when they get it out they become calmer and seek for answers to help them out. Hence this site.

The differance between a friend and a partner is sex. So a man or a woman who has a partner who cooks and cleans and is nice basically is in a physical relationship with someone who is more like a friend who cleans up. Think of all the friends you have. I bet they have nice personalities. I bet you like being around them. But your not having sex with these people. But in a relationship, where only that person is meant to fulfill your physical needs, and you look at them and see someone who seems more like your friend, then things can get hard.

A chain is only as strong as its weakest link. If your sex life is great, but the person doesn't help out or isn't kind to you, the sex life wont make the full relationship work.

If a person cleans, pays bills and looks after you, but won't communicate, then the fact they do dishes and pay bills wont make up for lack of communication or make the full relationship work.

If everything is great, except they treat the kids like nothing, then the relationship (and family) isn't going to work or be happy.

And its the same with sex lives. Everything needs to be there to make relationships work or keep it happy and functioning well. Like anything else, if a piece is missing it wont work, or at least not as effectivley.

Relationships are really hard things. They have never been easy and never will be.

As far as the looking at you with disgust and such, that definatly wasn't helpful.

What I'm basically saying by all of this is that all aspects of a relationship need to be there to balance it out and make it work.

posted by A101 on the My Fat Spouse forum

"Why did I get married"

I watched a television movie over the weekend entitled, "Why did I get married", which featured a fictional group of friends whose marriages all suffer from one challenge or another. I'm more into action and comedies, but thought I'd give it a try. I mention it here because the dynamic of one couple centered around her obesity/his infidelity. As the movie progressed, I found myself mystified and grouchy over how our society continues to perpetuate the obese martyr concept, which necessitates there be a villain(the fit spouse). As expected, the marriage failed, then the fat wife found herself a better, nicer, handsomer man, who loved her no matter what, so she just naturally dropped the pounds(yeah right), whilst her ex-husband was left to regret his bad choice. I've seen this dysfunctional theme repeated over and over again, both in fictional characters, and here on this forum. The fact is, if you love your spouse and want your marriage to succeed, you will keep it and yourself healthy. And, as a woman, I must say loud and clear, the human form is not appealing when distorted by obesity, and if you can't push your caboose up the hill, how the hell can you expect to sexually engage your spouse? Everything is compromised. You can't live a full, happy life unless/until you reclaim your health. You can't effectively contribute toward a wholesome marriage until you yourself are balanced.

Posted by Ann on the My Fat Spouse Forum

Mojo on Marriage

The institution of marriage existed long before the formation of the state or civil authority. From its very founding, the state had to recognize the institution of the marriage tradition in order to cement its legitimacy. The civic establishment's primary purpose should be to recognize and protect Individual Liberty and contract law. Instead, the secular state has encroached upon what was traditionally a sacred institution between God and Man(meaning man and woman). This corruption might be partly responsible for the crackup and disintegration of the Marriage Institution today, as one or both parties entering into a civil marriage may come to view the distorted enforcement of civil contract law(which is another topic altogether) as a means of obtaining advantage over the other spouse, i.e.: a spouse who though once attractive, becomes either fat, lazy and gluttonous, yet wanting to keep their health conscious spouse who remains attractive bonded to them by refusing to grant a divorce thus in essence preventing the fit spouse from legally finding another more suitable mate(FatSpouse therefore has no incentive to modify their behavior), or the obese spouse who uses the threat of the civic Tort Law to seize their spouses' property or future earnings should the other attempt divorce(again there is no incentive for the neglectful spouse to change either). Anciently there were many societies and cultures in existence that recognized the Rights of both men and women to marry or divorce whom ever and whenever they wanted, while protecting the property rights of both. Probably far from ideal by todays standards, Spartian women endured a tough life but also enjoyed many more rights and freedoms unheard of by most Greeks at the time, or even by modern women today. For instance, they could take a new husband if the old husband was gone away too long, and some even practiced polyandry (having more than one husband), they owned their own property and generally had a great deal of influence in the ruling of the then city-state of Sparta.

It was in these cultures, like ancient Sparta, that both men and women competed for mates, and after marriage continued to compete for those same affections. Maybe that's what is lacking today. I'm not saying, physically competing, but being able to have greater freedom to choose a mate, or not choose, and to be able to dissolve the covenant or take another spouse if need be should the former not fulfill their portion of the marriage contract. Perhaps then there would be a greater sense of accountably on account of each spouse, and therefor as a result, much less marital strife, discord and divorce. We claim to have so much more Freedom today, than our ancestors did, but do we really? Obviously this is true for much of the Western world, but I wonder if many of the problems that exist today like obesity and the failure of the Marriage Institution could have existed in ancient Sparta? I doubt it. I'm not advocating a conversion to a Spartan type culture, it was after all very brutal life in many ways, but in some ways the Spartans were way ahead of their time concerning certain aspects of Individual Liberty, especially for women. We could probably learn a thing or two by studying the lessons that history would like to teach us. Maybe we would be a lot happier in our marriages-we would certainly be a lot healthier.

Posted by Mojo on My Fat Spouse

How I got my Fat Husband to Lose Weight

I'm an avid distance runner, personal trainer and I've helped couples get in shape together, guiding them through the many obstacles that can occur in physically mismatched relationships.

I was once asked for help by a couple where the woman was an accomplished half-marathon runner and her husband had neglected his body for close to two decades. He was 30 pounds above anything resembling normal weight and 50 pounds heavier than a runner of his age would be.

His wife was light, even for a runner. She was 5 ft 1 inch and 106 lbs. Her husband was 5 ft 10 inches and 225 lbs. She ran at least eight miles, six days a week. Once a year, she attended a one-week running camp in New Mexico along with other competitive runners of all ages. She had detailed control over her food and fluid intake, eating no junk food and drinking no soda. Alcohol was a complete no-no.

The husband, in contrast, loved barbecue, burgers, French fries, relish and dressing, beer, red wine, and liquor. He was also a smoker. The closest he came to physical activity was watching football on Sundays.

On the positive side, he was aware of how big he had become. He wanted to quit smoking and was ready to reduce his alcohol intake because it was making him tired in the evenings, giving him hangovers in the morning, and it was adversely affecting his sex life.

Cutting out the smoking and reducing the alcohol was relatively easy to do because he was motivated to do it. Improving his diet proved more difficult because he loved fast food and hated salad and vegetables. (He also confided in me that he wanted his wife to be 20 or 30 pounds heavier than her race weight, which wasn't going to happen.)

At first, I asked the couple to train together for 30 minutes a day for two weeks. The woman would use these sessions as a cool-down after her runs. The aim was to get the husband to walk at a brisk, but not uncomfortable, pace for 30 minutes, stopping if he needed to catch his breath (the stops were not part of the 30 minutes, which got him used to using a runner's watch).

Proximity bias - why leading by example doesn't work

One of the most common pieces of advice handed out to unhappy fit spouses is to "lead by example", I've probably dished it out myself more times than I can remember. And yet, as most of you probably know all too well already, it rarely works. If it's any consolation, there's a scientific term for it, "proximity bias", meaning in plain language that people don't respect your knowledge and take your advice if they know you intimately.

Chris Shugart (yes, yes, I know, I keep quoting him, but it's because I usually like what he has to say) wrote an article on it, you can read it below.

However, in this context I can't resist relating my own experiences with proximity bias. In a nutshell, I'm very lean and fit but my husband of 20+ years is borderline obese. He'd like to lose weight and get in better shape but can't seem to find the right way to go about it. I keep trying to tell him what to do, but somehow to him I'm just lil' ol' me, and he seems to think I am what I am today because of genetics and my personality, not because I actually might have a fair amount of knowledge and personal experience as to how to lose fat permanently and get and stay in shape. Still, he has seen me go through a period when I was getting both fat, sedentary and unhealthy, but I managed to make a lasting lifestyle change almost two decades ago. Sure, I don't have any official credentials and can't call myself an expert and I've never worked as a personal trainer and I don't consider myself an athlete. To me what I do is just my normal way of life, nothing noteworthy or exceptional.

On the other hand, I often have new acquaintances inquire about what kind of sport I do, one fellow who is a plastic surgeon noted that I must be extremely active as it shows in the way I look and how I move. At the age of 44 I had a hysterectomy and at the pre-op medical check my doc stated "ah, so you must be an athlete". When I woke up post-op there was some sort of beep-alarm going off and a lot of commotion in the room, but the nurse at my bedside called out "don't worry, she's an athlete, her pulse is supposed to be very low". I recently joined a new gym, and at my introduction session the PT said, as we shook hands and introduced ourselves, "so you've obviously exercised a lot before". Later on one day the owner came up to me and stated that "you've obviously been exercising for several years, what kind of stuff have you done - I can see that you like working hard" and then went on to show me how to do squats, bench presses and assisted pullups, no extra charge (I'm a newbie at free weights). And so on and so forth, so I guess I know a thing or two that could come in useful for my hubby. And yet, he's not very interested in my "expertise". But lo and behold, this winter one of his buddies he hadn't seen for six months had lost a lot of weight and appeared much healthier than before. Hubs asked him what he'd done, and it turned out that he had followed the Michel Montignac-principles for half a year and was, of course, very enthusiastic. Montignac is a French chap who's written a diet-book that is basically new-school Atkins with a few twists. His conclusions are mostly bull***t, but there's plenty of lean proteins and enough fruit and veg to keep you healthy, so provided you control the amount you eat you certainly can and will lose weight on it.

My initial reaction was to tell hubs that there really is nothing that special about this particular diet, and in fact the science of it is completely flawed, but his response was "what do you know and look at this guy (his buddy), he's a walking testimony that it must work big time". - Okay, so I did the sensible thing and swallowed my pride and have been cooking "a la Montignac" for a couple of months now. Sure, hubby has actually lost some weight, although the process is very slow as he doesn't exercise that much and still tries to cheat whenever I turn my back. Good thing is he's found something he actually believes in and at least really tries to stick with. My "you shouldn't really eat that" never hit home, but a "that is not allowed on Montignac" is surprisingly effective! So whatever floats your boat and so on... and understanding "proximity bias" helps me deal with the fact that my knowledge and expertise is worth less than that of a populistic Frenchman and a guy who very recently managed to lose part of his excess weight....

Anyways, here's the article I was talking about

Fat is Bad for Married Sex

Does the idea of having sex with your fat spouse really get you excited?
With the exception of a few people with “fat fetishes”, having sex with your
fat wife or husband either feels obligatory, or meets the bare standard of
releasing you’re pent up sexual desire. The overweight partner has even
greater issues when it comes to sex, which often goes beyond the
psychological. The desire to have sex with a trim sexy partner isn’t a
fabricated Hollywood myth; the science behind sexual interest in fit
bodies is real and has been confirmed over and over, it is undeniable to
a reasonable person.

If you and your spouse can't communicate about the weight issue- by 'Elizabeth'

I am a marriage counselor and psychotherapist and I have heard this story before. I have a patient who met with his wife's therapist with his wife about 5-10 years ago and complained about her weight and was reprimanded. The wife ended up losing weight anyway and they are still married but having other problems. I think it's terrible that the former counselor told my patient that he was out of line for commenting on his wife's weight. I don't know how fat she was exactly, but she is normal size, not skinny, now. Of course, my patient has had his own problems; he had a drug problem for a long time but is now in recovery.
For weight problems I recommend either Weight Watchers or Overeaters Anonymous. Everyone I know who has gone to Weight Watchers has lost weight, anywhere from 7 to 100 lbs. I've heard fewer success stories from OA but I think that's because OA addresses compulsive behavior rather than portion control.
If you and your spouse can't communicate about the weight issue, I suggest marital counseling.

I don't see a lot of obese people in my practice because I am located in Manhattan. People here have to walk to get around, even if they own cars, and there is a heavy (no pun intended) emphasis on fashion, looks and style.

In most cases of obesity, unless there is a medical complication such as polycystic ovary syndrome, the obesity is an addiction just like any other addiction. It's essential for any addict to take responsibility for their behavior. That's what the 12-step program is focused on. I think overeating is a difficult addiction though because the original 12-step programs were based on complete abstinence. Addicts in general have difficulty taking responsibility for their behavior. At heart the problem is characterological. Many addicts have personality traits of passivity and entitlement. That's why they often aren't sympathetic to others.For the spouse, I noticed that somewhere on this site there is an ad for the book "Fat is a Family Affair" which I highly recommend. It's possible the spouse is engaged in some type of co-dependent behavior. Also, if the obesity didn't exist at all before the marriage, it's possible that unspoken resentments, sexual issues and other problems are contributing.

Elizabeth wrote this for the My Fat Spouse Forum

A Fat Spouse like the Blacksmith who left out the 'Nail' that Lost the Kingdom by Mojo

Most agree that the marriage is a form of a contract or agreement of one form or another, either secular, civil, ecclesiastical, individual or a combination of all to varying degrees. Regardless, I could relate this to the binding contract or oath of many, both men and women, who serve in the Military. Most all Armies of the world, without exception, have certain health standards that are based ,among others, mainly on height to weight ratio or BMI. These standards exist for many obvious reasons, namely, the Battlefield is not “normalized” to give weaker enemy soldiers a 'fair shake'. Certain standards are required prior to enlistment or commission, and are expected to be maintained throughout. Failure to maintain these standards usually results in various forms of disciplining, counseling, or outright termination and discharge; usually under 'dishonorable' or 'less than honorable' conditions. The military considers the soldier's body as not his own, but the Army's. However, the soldier has 'stewardship' over what the Army considers 'government property'.
While in the Service, I witnessed a soldier receive a Article 15 (reprimand) for not wearing his uniform top while digging a fighting position in the desert sun. The soldier stated that he was hot and that he felt “more comfortable” not wearing his shirt which he said made him sweat, even though he had been previously counseled to avoid exposing the bare skin to the sun’s intense rays. The over exposure resulted in a severe sunburn, and subsequent issue by medical personnel, a temporary 'profile' that prevented this soldier from performing all of his expected duties. His superiors charged the soldier with "Destruction of Government Property." The reprimand he eventually received was considered by many of his peers to be "too extreme"-at the time, I felt as did the others. However, with experience that usually accompanies age, I now see the wisdom of the commanding officers in meting out the form of punishment ultimately given. No others followed suit. The details here are not as important as the principle. The soldier had taken an oath to the organization to which he joined himself voluntarily. The oath of his allegiance required certain performances and expectations of duty or sacrifice. In exchange the soldier received certain basic necessities, like food, clothing, housing, and pay; and other privileges like funding for future education, along with other benefits. Although the soldier's actions were judged not to be due to 'malingering'(feigning illness to avoid combat or duty), his neglect had the same end result, in that he was unable, for a period of time at least, to fulfill his duty. Therefore he became a liability to his unit rather than an asset, in that he was using organizational resources, but unable to carryout the responsibility untrusted to him. He thus became a "weak link" in the organization chain. His neglect to use 'common sense' in a combat environment greatly compromised not only his own safety and ability to safeguard his position, but the safety of his "fellows" who trusted him to watch their flanks while they watched his, and ultimately the safety of the entire unit and its ability to accomplish the mission. He had not become a casualty while fighting the enemy or in the performance of his required duty, but was a casualty of his own wanton ignorance and neglect. The derelict soldier can be likened to King’s Blacksmith in the fabled story,"For want of a nail the Kingdom was lost.”

Confessions of a COE

Written by "Jean" for myfatspouse.com

The other day Shep and I started wrestling around on the bed in play. I'm a lot smaller than he is, but that doesn't really matter much - a wife can figure out all sorts of devious ways to give as good as she gets in such areas: I take advantage of my lower center of gravity, and I know all the most sensitive tickle spots.

Left breathless by our spirited play, we finally fell back on the bed, panting slightly and enjoying the sound of the Saturday afternoon rain on the window. After a bit, Shep pulled me close, kissed my forehead, and whispered in my ear, "This is the wife I dreamed of."

Less than a year ago, I was nearly as far from Shep's "dream wife" - from the woman he had thought he was marrying - as it was possible to get. At six feet one inch tall, Shep weighs 200 pounds; at five feet four inches tall, I outweighed him by eight pounds (that was my all-time high, and I pray earnestly for the strength to prevent that from ever happening again). In addition to this (as if that wasn't enough!), I was an emotional basket case, a nervous wreck, and a nagging shrew with a self-esteem that was right up there with pond scum. My health was poor, my energy-level was at "E," and I accomplished almost nothing outside work (and had trouble at work, as well). Why would an intelligent woman do this to herself, to her husband? Why would she behave in a manner that would threaten her marriage and her very life?

Hi. My name is Jean, and I am a compulsive eater. What is compulsive eating disorder, you ask? Compulsive eaters feel incapable of controlling how much or how often they eat. They may feel unable to stop eating, eat very fast, eat when they're not hungry, eat only when they're alone, or eat nearly non-stop throughout the day. Compulsive eaters often over-indulge in sugary or starchy foods and use them in an attempt to elevate their moods. When they don't eat the foods they crave, they often experience severe withdrawal symptoms (like headaches, shakiness, sugar "crashes," and more). It is an eating disorder that gets a lot less attention than bulimia or anorexia, but one which, I suspect, is a lot more prevalent in our society today.

Why do people become compulsive eaters? Well, there are a million reasons, and sometimes maybe even no reason at all. I'm sure you've heard the phrase, "It's not what you're eating; it's what's eating you." That can be part of it - bingeing can produce a "high" or "buzz" from the release of endorphins into the brain which becomes a coping mechanism for people dealing with stress, anxiety, or the aftermath of life with a dysfunctional family. It tends to run in families, but not always. It can be a physical addiction similar to nicotine addiction, where sugary and/or starchy foods produce a similar calming effect that requires ever-larger quantities of food to maintain. Either way, it is a progressive, destructive addiction, leading to many problems both physical and emotional.

Shep didn't know I was a compulsive eater when I married him. I'm ashamed to say that I kept it from him. In my defense, I can only offer that I had really only just figured it out myself, and I had hopes that I could control it on my own and keep it out of our life together. My poor eating habits had begun in childhood and my weight had yo-yoed up and down over the years. By the time I met Shep (at twenty-five), I began to realize something was not right about the way I viewed food. People without weight problems did not obsess about it the way I did. Normal people didn't lock themselves in their rooms with a book, and use a bag of chips or a box of cookies to escape life's problems. People often say, "Diets don't work." Well, that's not true: diets do work if you follow them and your goal is to lose weight. If, however, you are COE (compulsive overeater), they won't work to keep the weight off because you're only addressing part of the problem; what you need is a lifestyle change. To a COE, going on a diet alone would be like a person with bronchitis taking cough medicine, but no antibiotics - she's treating a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.

A Change in Attitude

Posted by Rick Dorey on The My Fat Spouse Forum

I read here how the one that is in good shape or health often feels like giving up on their spouse. In the stories you see that it was a change that came over time and often that the "skinny" spouse is no longer in love or even no longer sexually attracted to their spouse.

That is usually followed by statements like I can talk to them about their weight problem and I can't take it much longer. Well Matilda asked me to share my story. I weighed in at 300 lbs and my wife and I have been married for 34 years this year. We are deeper in love with each other then we have ever been. But not for the reason that I lost over 100 lbs and continue to work on it. That all happened in this past year.

No the reason was is that we know that obesity is not the fault of the person that is effected by it. You see our food industry is as much at fault as any "fat spouse". There of course are circumstance that add gradually to the situation. Mine was sleep apnea which dumps chemicals into your body that causes weight retention raises blood pressure. Then the doctor put me on blood pressure meds that slowed the possibility of weight loss. Over time I went from 185 to 300. It wasn't overnight. It did not go unnoticed by me. It just kept coming no matter what I did.

Before I finally found something that worked, I had been to several doctors, cut my calories to around 2000 a day and exercised at a gym 3 times a week. Still with no success. My doctor wanted to add even more meds for the blood pressure and slow down any possibility for weight loss. I had no energy and my body hurt every day when I got up. Obesity is an illness, it is not just lack of will power. It is also becoming the number 1 killer in America. So sweeping it under the rug in our homes won't work either.

We need to change our attitude. We need to stop worrying about being politically correct with our spouses. It needs to be ok to say "I love you and want you around for the rest of my life, what can I do to help make it possible?" But it is never time to condemn or point fingers. Remember when you stop loving someone for the way they look it is because they are a spiritual mirror. You see something in your life that isn't being taken care of or isn't what it should be. When you point fingers at someone there are three more coming back.

For those of you about to give up on your Fat spouse ask this question. Would I give up on them if they had been crippled in a car accident or was dying from a terminal disease? Or would I stick by their side and love them and support them? Would you encourage them to keep going or would you walk out the door? It is a choice that shows a depth of love. Why does weight have any different feel to it?

That is enough for now to get me hammered pretty good for my first post. But let me finish with this. You can love and inspire those in your lives that you care about to change. It is a inspiration process though and not a shame process.

Rick
rick@coachtolose.com

Rick's Blog

Fat Men, Fat Women and Relationships

So it's rare on TV and such to see shows that pair an obese woman with a thin, muscular, hot man. But it's pretty common (as Smallwife said) to see shows where an obese man is paired with a fit, hot wife. Starting with the Honeymooners back in the 50's, and now we've recently seen it in shows like King of Queens and Family Guy (which is a cartoon, I know, but still...). It's an odd thing. Usually if there's a fat wife in a show, she is also paired with a fat husband (Rosanne is a good example, although not recent).

I know TV is fiction and can't possibly reflect real life, but I see a double standard. I'm not saying the evil patriarchy has anything to do with it or anything like that, it's just an interesting thing I've noticed about our pop culture. That it's somehow more okay for a man to be fat than a woman.

To me, a fat man is just as unappealing as a fat woman. Some people seem to think that fat men are like "teddy bears" or are "more cuddly." I tend to disagree.

Mountain of Love

I have been reading and posting here and on the old MFS for some time.

Something has always puzzled me.

The talk about love! There is the love for a child which is unconditional love but there are still borders and consequences of wrong behaviour.

Then there is the love for the partner....an adult and sometimes it looks to me like there are no borders! Why?
Love to me doesn't mean that I am getting treated like an emotional garbage bin, a cash cow, a slave!
I am not the supervisior of my partners food intake, I am not the one to talk him into exercise, I am not the one who wipes his butt because he is too fat to do it himself. I am not the one to make excuses for him cause he can't to things ....because he is too fat.

Love to me means to respect my partner and be respected by him! It means that I try to make our life easier and I expect the same from him! It means that I try to be the best person I can be .....so our life is good! It means that I stay fit and healthy so I can be a good partner for a long time and we can have fun together, be it hiking, camping, kayaking....whatever! It means I dress myself nicely when we go out because I want him to be proud of me. It means that I help him when he needs me!

So many times, when I read about love here, it sounds so one sided. " I still love him......." but the partner is doing nothing to deserve this love! Au contraire, he does everything to kill the love!
And still .....people take it.....why..... I can't understand it.
If I am not valued as a person and partner, I am out of the relationsship....cause I am not happy and neither is my partner....so why stay?

Your Fat Spouse Podcast

Has weight become a “big” issue in your relationship? Many marriages run into trouble when one spouse puts on a significant amount of weight, as this change can have a severe impact on intimacy, control issues, and health. Dr. Susan Orenstein discusses the factors that can cause a spouse to gain weight, the relationship between eating and emotions, and how to approach this touchy subject with your spouse in a way that doesn’t cause even more tension.

Dr. Orenstein is a licensed Psychologist with a private practice in Cary, NC and a newly opened location in Chapel Hill, NC. She also conducts the Stay Happily Married seminar series in Raleigh. You can find out more about Dr. Orenstein at www.orensteinsolutions.com

Check Out This Link to listen

http://cdn1.libsyn.com/rosen/SHM-72-07272009.mp3?nvb=20091213031225&nva=20091214032225&t=0067ed7d61d668f13cf82